PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Official Development, Research and Progress directly from Cybdyn Systems
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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by flynnz » May 16th, 2022, 11:55 am

Matt wrote: May 16th, 2022, 11:41 am
flynnz wrote: May 16th, 2022, 11:33 am
Takehaniyasubiko wrote: May 15th, 2022, 3:23 am Just make sure Crisis Beat works at some point and that we get the core fixes sometime this year, Matt. :P
I am also interested in knowing if there will be a fix in the next update for the random crashes of unknown amounts of games. Without that being fixed, I still will have no interest in using the PSIO in any real capacity.
What games are randomly freezing for you exactly at the moment?
The last issues I DO remember having, were pretty early on, so it wouldn't be fair to bring them up now as I am sure a lot of those issues have been addressed. I haven't used my PSIO in a while, But for me, at this point, it's more about not wanting to find out ya know? I have read enough to know that there is still a fair amount of crashing issues with random games, so that was enough for me to wait (and wait and wait :P) for the update that would hopefully address these global timing issues before using the PSIO again. I'm sure for most people, the potential rarity of the crashing isn't enough to sway them from using the product, but as I said in another post, it's just something that would constantly be in the back of my head while playing. So for me personally, it's still something I am very hopeful will be fixed.

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Matt » May 16th, 2022, 12:49 pm

Most of the crashes that have been reported are unable to be replicated by us and we came to the conclusion it could be from a degrading power supply, parallel port connection, bad solder joint on the PlayStation mainboard, etc.

That said, the new update made some serious changes to the sync timer code. Everything is now locked to the PlayStation clock timings so in the event where some were legitimate (such as Final Fantasy stuttering by something like 1 or 2 frames which I couldn't even see why my own eyes and had to use a capture card to find it) should be fixed :)
:null:
Takehaniyasubiko wrote: May 16th, 2022, 11:48 am
Matt wrote: May 16th, 2022, 11:41 amWhat games are randomly freezing for you exactly at the moment?
Wipeout XL, Final Fantasy VIII, Chrono Cross, Vagrant Story, Front Mission 3, Vampire Hunter D, and... that's where I simply stopped playing and decided to wait for a fix. Trust me, Matt, if you're actually playing long, story-driven games, you'll run into random freezes with the current firmware. It's a mess.
Ah yes, WipEout XL was horrid. That's all fixed now though in the upcoming update so all the others you mentioned should be as well :P

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Takehaniyasubiko » May 17th, 2022, 12:16 am

Matt wrote: May 16th, 2022, 12:49 pmMost of the crashes that have been reported are unable to be replicated by us and we came to the conclusion it could be from a degrading power supply, parallel port connection, bad solder joint on the PlayStation mainboard, etc.
They are replicable. You just have to play a given game for longer than 20-30 minutes. BTW, my power supply was recapped, my parallel connection is rock solid after cleaning it and securing PSIO with a professional double-sided tape, and my PS1 motherboard was recapped as well. The proof it's not a hardware problem is that the same games will never freeze when run on the same console from a good CD-ROM. Multiple people can confirm the issues with the games I mentioned. It's a timing problem in the current public firmware.

The best proof that the current public firmware is borked - battles in Inuyasha: A Feudal Fairy Tale won't play at all, which is a sign of timing issues as the same problem was investigated before.

But just like you said, since Wipeout XL is now fixed, the other freezes should be fixed as well because it was all tied to the same underlying issues with data transferring. Locking the PSIO side to the PlayStation clock timings should help a lot. I'm surprised it wasn't done at the start of this project, but I guess you guys are growing with PSIO.
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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by sundeth » May 19th, 2022, 12:24 am

I plan to install a PSIO on my slim PSOne. I know it's not officially supported, but do you know if the next patch can affect it? Is there any plans for an official way to do it?

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Matt » May 19th, 2022, 4:53 am

sundeth wrote: May 19th, 2022, 12:24 am I plan to install a PSIO on my slim PSOne. I know it's not officially supported, but do you know if the next patch can affect it? Is there any plans for an official way to do it?
We plan to have an official board for the PSone available when the chip shortage is over.

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by wanderer » May 21st, 2022, 7:23 am

Things that make PSIO better than XStation :
•Keeps the CD drive
•Has a better handling of multidisc games
•Easier install
•Compatible with a wider range of boards

Things that make XStation better than PSIO :
•Has disc chaining
•100% compatibility
•Better accuracy (low level emulation)
•Libcrypt support
•Memcard Pro support
•PS1 Digital support
•Ecc data correction
•Folder in folder support
•Redump support
•Easier firmware update
•Cheaper & ships out faster
•Has a game cache list
•Can boot straight up to last played game at startup
•No k1v1/2/3/4 mode to choose
•No cu2 sheet to make for CDDA games
•No 60 caracter filename restriction
•More frequent updates
•Doesn't have someone like Takehaniyasubiko in the community

Now this list may seem to come out of the blue but I've been thinking of reasons to keep my PSIO and unfortunately, I can't think of many... Right now I favor XStation over PSIO and I don't think the opposite will ever happen. Depending on how the next update turns out I may keep or resell my PSIO...

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by bikerspade » May 21st, 2022, 7:42 am

I disagree about multidisc handling; Xstation handles it better since it lets you add any arbitrary discs to a queue, and only requires opening and closing the lid to switch to the next disc. There isn’t a clean way to use append discs with Pop ‘n Music via PSIO, and you have to eject your sd card which is risky and can be difficult depending on how your console is situated.

I think it needs to be said that the PSIO menu is way nicer than Xstation; the latter is damn near unreadable on a CRT with composite video.

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by sosafire » May 21st, 2022, 7:45 am

I love this kind of comparison! Thanks for listing them ^^ Can we install a psio and an x ??station on the same console? (the ps1 digital can pose a problem on an additional installation with the x station)

Indeed I was also considering getting an x-station, the prolonged waits prevent me from playing the PS1 properly, so the mister fpga completely fulfilled this role during this time despite everything, with these options that make you dream and allow things that even emulators can't do!
I now look with more hindsight now the psio and maybe less interest than before, but I really want to see what the plug and play version of Cybdyn which could be THE ultimate version for the ps1 (with the psio of course ) or not !

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Takehaniyasubiko » May 21st, 2022, 7:55 am

It's like comparing apples and oranges.

PSIO is a flash cart with full access to the parallel port: it can do a lot of of things no ODE will be able to. For example, PSIO uses a very clever way to deliver CDDA audio with no random click or drops in playback quality. Both MODE and X-station have design flaws which stop them from delivering CDDA audio flawlessly.

I don't understand why some people are obsessed with picking one over the other. Why should the existence of device X nullify the existence of device Y?

The only serious problem with PSIO right now is the wonky CD-ROM emulation timing in the public firmware. Once the update drops, I will be very happy with my PSIO.
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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Superevil » May 21st, 2022, 12:56 pm

Takehaniyasubiko wrote: May 21st, 2022, 7:55 am It's like comparing apples and oranges.
No, it's like comparing an apple to an apple. Both of these devices advertise themselves as a Playstation ODE, and that's what they both function as. It's a very fair comparison between two directly competing products.

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by BahamutBBob » May 21st, 2022, 1:48 pm

The PSIO advertises itself as a development cart, and Matt is beefing up the development features as part of the next update (unless that part has been pushed back)

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Takehaniyasubiko » May 21st, 2022, 7:55 pm

Superevil wrote: May 21st, 2022, 12:56 pmNo, it's like comparing an apple to an apple. Both of these devices advertise themselves as a Playstation ODE, and that's what they both function as.
No, PSIO is advertised as a flash cart emulator of the CD-ROM co-processor (SUB-CPU), with extra development features thrown in thanks to its connection with PlayStation’s Parallel I/O Port.

The SUB-CPU emulation is borked in the current public firmware, but Matt and Yuri already fixed that in their internal firmware, so once it becomes public, PSIO will be great at what it promised.
"Because we don't know when we will die, we get to think of life as an inexhaustible well. Yet everything happens only a certain number of times, and a very small number really. How many more times will you remember a certain afternoon of your childhood, an afternoon that is so deeply a part of your being that you can't even conceive of your life without it? Perhaps four, five times more, perhaps not even that."
- Paul Bowles

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Syntax » May 21st, 2022, 9:09 pm

Put your hand up if you purchased a PSIO for its promised development features, or if you even know what that means?
PSIO Switchboard Install and Console Mod Service (Australia/Worldwide)
viewtopic.php?f=72&t=3143

PSIO COMPLETE 1G1R cu2 and BMP collection with ReDump names
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1yGAYhO ... sp=sharing

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by bikerspade » May 22nd, 2022, 12:10 am

When testing this new beta firmware, it might be prudent to review and test all of the games that presently have issues with the PSX core on MiSTer. https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/PSX_MiSTer/issues

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Takehaniyasubiko » May 22nd, 2022, 12:30 am

bikerspade wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 12:10 amWhen testing this new beta firmware, it might be prudent to review and test all of the games that presently have issues with the PSX core on MiSTer. https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/PSX_MiSTer/issues
Most of them will work fine for sure because the issues they have on MiSTer come from its GPU emulation, but you are right that it's a good list to check against since it shows games which are especially sensitive to any changes in the hardware they run on.
"Because we don't know when we will die, we get to think of life as an inexhaustible well. Yet everything happens only a certain number of times, and a very small number really. How many more times will you remember a certain afternoon of your childhood, an afternoon that is so deeply a part of your being that you can't even conceive of your life without it? Perhaps four, five times more, perhaps not even that."
- Paul Bowles

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Superevil » May 22nd, 2022, 2:44 am

Takehaniyasubiko wrote: May 21st, 2022, 7:55 pm
Superevil wrote: May 21st, 2022, 12:56 pmNo, it's like comparing an apple to an apple. Both of these devices advertise themselves as a Playstation ODE, and that's what they both function as.
No, PSIO is advertised as a flash cart emulator of the CD-ROM co-processor (SUB-CPU), with extra development features thrown in thanks to its connection with PlayStation’s Parallel I/O Port.

The SUB-CPU emulation is borked in the current public firmware, but Matt and Yuri already fixed that in their internal firmware, so once it becomes public, PSIO will be great at what it promised.
Image
Not sure what product you’re talking about.

Resellers seem to be confused too:
Image

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Takehaniyasubiko » May 22nd, 2022, 3:00 am

Superevil wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 2:44 amNot sure what product you’re talking about.
Literally the picture you posted says it's a flash cart. ODEs and flash carts are not the same thing. PSIO is used for playing disc images, but it's not an ODE.

The eBay auction isn't anything official and it's a mistake to lump together different devices like that. It's exactly this kind of neglect that causes all the misinformation on the net.
"Because we don't know when we will die, we get to think of life as an inexhaustible well. Yet everything happens only a certain number of times, and a very small number really. How many more times will you remember a certain afternoon of your childhood, an afternoon that is so deeply a part of your being that you can't even conceive of your life without it? Perhaps four, five times more, perhaps not even that."
- Paul Bowles

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Superevil » May 22nd, 2022, 3:14 am

Takehaniyasubiko wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:00 am
Superevil wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 2:44 amNot sure what product you’re talking about.
Literally the picture you posted says it's a flash cart. ODEs and flash carts are not the same thing. PSIO is used for playing disc images, but it's not an ODE.

The eBay auction isn't anything official and it's a mistake to lump together different devices like that. It's exactly this kind of neglect that causes all the misinformation on the net.
That’s not an eBay listing, it’s an official reseller retromoddings listing of it. You can find that reseller listed on this site. It is literally described as an ‘Everdrive’ in the FAQ. You’re wrong if you think this product isn’t marketed as a piracy device and compared regularly to the XStation on virtually every medium it’s discussed.

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Takehaniyasubiko » May 22nd, 2022, 3:29 am

Superevil wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:14 amIt is literally described as an ‘Everdrive’ in the FAQ.
EverDrives are literally flash carts, not ODEs. You don't understand the difference, hence this back and forth.

Flash carts are used to play games, yes, but they are NOT optical disc emulators. PSIO is not actually emulating the CD-ROM. It's emulating the SUB-CPU (the CD-ROM commands, basically). It's not the same type of a device. That's why you plug it into the parallel port, not into the CD-ROM socket. This solution has its strengthens and weaknesses over an ODE design, and it's not the same thing.
"Because we don't know when we will die, we get to think of life as an inexhaustible well. Yet everything happens only a certain number of times, and a very small number really. How many more times will you remember a certain afternoon of your childhood, an afternoon that is so deeply a part of your being that you can't even conceive of your life without it? Perhaps four, five times more, perhaps not even that."
- Paul Bowles

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Re: PSIO Development Discussion Thread

Post by Superevil » May 22nd, 2022, 3:37 am

Takehaniyasubiko wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:29 am
Superevil wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:14 amIt is literally described as an ‘Everdrive’ in the FAQ.
EverDrives are literally flash carts, not ODEs. You don't understand the difference, hence this back and forth.

Flash carts are used to play games, yes, but they are NOT optical disc emulators. PSIO is not actually emulating the CD-ROM. It's emulating the SUB-CPU (the CD-ROM commands, basically). It's not the same type of a device. That's why you plug it into the parallel port, not into the CD-ROM socket.
I understand the difference, it’s literally in the name. You’re claiming that PSIO is sold explicitly as a development/debugging tool, which is just not true. It is an ODE and even a Flashcart by its own and other sellers claims. It is 100% comparable to other products making the same the claims.

Another example:
Image

If it is not designed to function as an ODE, then anything other than development purposes and compatibly with commercial products such as your precious Crisis Beat wouldn’t be a concern or promise at this point. Stop telling people they shouldn’t compare piracy devices.

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